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Bigmagic
I searched this forum but I came up with nothing, so I decided to post my questions.

When I make my strings, it never fails that no matter how slowly and careful I am, the strings always turn out to be a different size. I cannot figure out what that is happening. I measure everything including the loops, but I am still having difficulties.

I use 3Rivers string jig, with B50, as well as the 3 Rivers DVD. I am quite sure the error is with the operator rather than the materials.  Maybe someone can offer some advice to correct my dilemma?

Also, after quite a search for "Doin the Twist" DVD, it looks like it is no longer made, and hard to find. Dose anyone have any suggestions? I did find How to Build a Great Bowstring by Chad Weaver and Rod Jenkins. Any thoughts on that?

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Selden Slider
If the individual strand lengths are correct your problem lies in how tight/loose you make the twists.  It can't be much else.  Frank
Charter Member Traditional Archery Society
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Paul Webber
I have the same problem! And I keep notes for the number of twists per loop and splice. For some reason my results are more consistent if I use a modern material like D97. But that stuff is double the price for half the material and can still be hit or miss on the length. I'm think'n bout throwing in the towel and just ordering from the custom string guys.

Hopefully somebody here has some master tips & tricks advice (fingers crossed)
HHA Cheetah 66” #45@27”
HHA Legend Stick 66” #45@27”
HHA Tembo 66” #44@27”
McBroom Stringfollow 66” #45@28”
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aromakr
Its about doing everything exactly the same every time. measure the pigtail length, count the number of twists in each loop, then you can adjust the final length with the number of twist in the string. Its all about uniformity.

Bob 
Life Member PBS - Member TBM -Life Member Calif. Big game club - Sponsor Traditional Archery Society
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chuckc
The number of twists and how tight they are matters. Kinda like knitting. Some loose and some tight means a less than stellar product is looming.

I am not so great either so...I do the best I can. Start at a measured location. Count twists. Make them appear alike. Once done I put them on a stretcher and make sure they are at least long enough. Then I twist it to fit. Too long is also not good...that being so long that it takes an inordinate number of twists to make it fit well.




See if you can find any youtube videos by Ryan Sanpei. He is pretty awesome and explains well.
ChuckC

Charter Member Traditional Archery Society

I did too !

Madison, Wisconsin.   Public land hunter
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Old Sailor
I have the same problem because I have not kept accurate records of each string so it is almost like starting over each time.  I usually have to undo one end and make adjustments before getting it just right.
Charter Member Traditional Archery Society
Member Colorado Traditional Archery Society

JD Berry Morning Star 54#@28, Northern Mist Classic 54#@28Sovereign Ballistik 60#28, Howatt Hunter 55#@28, Ben Pearson Mustang 46#@28

"But God demonstrates His own love towards us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us."  Romans 5:8

"The problem is not guns, It's hearts without God, Homes without discipline, Schools without prayer, and Courtrooms without justice" ; unknown.

Durango, Colorado
Public Land Hunter
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Bigmagic
Counting twists and making sure they each are the same tension makes complete sense to me. After experiences, I know that I did not do that. That would certainly the string lengths different every time. 
don't know why I didn't realize that earlier since I learned to knit at an early age and still do.

Thanks's for all your help and comments. I'll try a couple tomorrow. I'll let you all know how it goes.
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fdp
 How do you condition your strings after you twist them up? Do you stretch them and burnish them?

 Bob is right (as he typically is) the process has to be consistent and uniform.
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Gypsy
Different folks may and probably will handle their strings differently after twisting them up and prior to serving it. I brace it up on the bow, and with a small piece of leather or folded paper towel, vigorously rub up and down the string producing heat which melts the wax and tightening up the string bundles. Then I will draw the bow many times, check the brace height and re-adjust. Then I like to leave it strung over night, re-adjust brace height if necessary the add the serving. Anyway it works for me.
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Bigmagic
Gypsy wrote:
I brace it up on the bow, and with a small piece of leather or folded paper towel, vigorously rub up and down the string producing heat which melts the wax and tightening up the string bundles. Then I will draw the bow many times, check the brace height and re-adjust.


That's how I do it too. I use a piece of leather to burnish the string. Once I do get the string the right length (sometimes after making 2 or 3, they work great. I just don't like wasting that much string making them until I get the right length.
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Bigmagic
I took everyone's advice. I made a string, making sure my grip on the string was the same, the same number of twists, and the same tension. I also tried to make all the twists look as identical as I could. My first string was about 1/4 inch short of what I was shooting for.

My second string, using the same guidelines. was barely over 1/2 inch shorter than that one. But, I was interrupted and I needed to get finished with it, (good excuse as any) but even then that's a lot better than was I used to do. And I'm thinking a half inch isn't too awfully bad is it?

I have a lot of string, so I am going to try to perfect my techniques to see if I can become more consistent. I am confident that by doing it that way, they will be a lot better than the way I was doing it.

Thanks for everyone's help. I appreciate it a lot.



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Bucknut
A string stretcher will help a lot in your finished product.  As for the video question. Both are very good.
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chuckc
Both might stretch into use. The shorter one almost for certain. Make a stretcher or just use a bow to stretch it.

I use pieces from a ratchet strap. Attach a hex bolt thru a 2x4 in the basement or garage...near the floor. One loop goes over that. Attach the ratchet to the top of the same 2x4, using another hex bolt. Leave enough room for any string, plus a length of the strap with hook, assembled on the ratchet. One loop on the bottom bolt... other on the hook. I draw inch lines on the 2x4 so I can be sure to try to stretch it as I need it.
ChuckC

Charter Member Traditional Archery Society

I did too !

Madison, Wisconsin.   Public land hunter
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aromakr
Chuckc:

Another way to stretch the string is to just twist it up 1-1 1/2" shorter than needed. String up the bow, sit in a chair, place the bow in you lap string up and push down on the limb tips several times. Adjust the string and repeat. It might need a slight adjustment after a dozen of so shots
That's all I've ever done for many years.

Bob 
Life Member PBS - Member TBM -Life Member Calif. Big game club - Sponsor Traditional Archery Society
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chuckc
Yup. Yet another way. Thanks !
ChuckC

Charter Member Traditional Archery Society

I did too !

Madison, Wisconsin.   Public land hunter
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Bigmagic
Chuckc ~ the advantage to stretching a string using a rig like you described, is if I'm making a string for any of my buddies and I can't stretch the string on their bow. I like it. I'm going to rig one up.
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Bigmagic
Here I am with another question.

I was watching a Ryan Sanpei video on how to tie an adjustable nock. He had the string on a string stretcher and was indicating where he wanted to put the nock my marking the spot.

The problem I have with this is when I tie on a new nock, rather than using a bow square (which I have found to not be reliable for me when putting on a new nock), I put an arrow on the bow and 'eye ball' it. It works for me most of the time. But I am curious how Mr. Sanpei knows exactly where to put the nock if it is not on a bow. 
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Old Sailor
Since it is adjustable he probably measures to get it close and then it is adjusted after placing on the bow. I always use a bow square. If I just eyeballed it I would probably have a mess.
Charter Member Traditional Archery Society
Member Colorado Traditional Archery Society

JD Berry Morning Star 54#@28, Northern Mist Classic 54#@28Sovereign Ballistik 60#28, Howatt Hunter 55#@28, Ben Pearson Mustang 46#@28

"But God demonstrates His own love towards us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us."  Romans 5:8

"The problem is not guns, It's hearts without God, Homes without discipline, Schools without prayer, and Courtrooms without justice" ; unknown.

Durango, Colorado
Public Land Hunter
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Orion
He knows where to put it because he's replicating a string/dimension he already has.  If it were a bow he wan't familiar with, he wouldn't be able to do it.  Well, then again, he could, because if you have a tie-on nock that's adjustable, you only have to get in the vicinity of it's final position and can adjust it once it's put on the bow.

I don't know how a bow square can not work for you.  It's the only tool that ensures that you always put the nock at the same height from string to string.  Eyeballing just isn't as accurate. I'm sure there's a video on U=tube that shows how to use a bow square to set a nock point.  Good luck.
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Bigmagic
I have also noticed that in some of the many videos on making strings, some use a jig where the ends of the string end up being different lengths before making the loops, and some where they measure then cut the sting all the same length, then make the strings in the same way.

To me, the one's that have the ends the same length look cleaner in the end result. All the string I have made using the jig I bought from 3 Rivers, need to be trimmed, sometimes even after the string has been used a bunch of times for a cleaner look. I am thinking this is purely aesthetics, but is there any advantage of one over way over the other?
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Ric O'Shay
The tapered length strands provide a gradual taper from the loops to the string. To me this makes a more professional look to the string than to abruptly stop 32 strand string ends to the 16 strand string.
Another way to insure the correct string length is to precisely measure the old string from loop end to loop end and cut your string bundles accordingly. Then when you twist up one loop, hang the new string from a nail and measure out the old string length (after back twisting each bundle). Start your 2nd loop at the measurement of the old string. This will give you the length you need to add twists to the string to give you the exact length after stretching the string. That said, you still need to be precise in making you twists the same way each time.
Additionally, in order to make your strings look a little more professional, after making the loops and before twisting the string, take about three inches of string from where your bundles end and twist that up fairly tight. Then repeat on the other end of the string. Now you are ready to twist the string the desired number of twists and to the correct length. All this does is to provide a nice looking, continual taper from the loops to the start of the string. Hope this helps and was not too confusing.
Charter Member Traditional Archery Society
66" J.D. Berry Vixens and Heritage - The Berry Best Bowyer that I know...[thumb]

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chuckc
Jumping in....yeah, I too recommend using tapered ends. You don't want them to end all at once. Don't look as nice and maybe isn't as sturdy. In any case, when the ends run out there will always be at least the length of one wrap sticking out for each strand ending. Cut or burn em off.

You know, you can also use the endless loop string on long bows. Those are easier to get a near perfect length on.
ChuckC

Charter Member Traditional Archery Society

I did too !

Madison, Wisconsin.   Public land hunter
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